Christine Garvin 0:02
Hey everyone, welcome to this week’s episode of Hormonally Speaking, we’ve got a special episode for you today. That is, to me, I wanted to speak with this guest because she’s had such a fascinating journey in terms of her own Hormonal Health, and all the sort of ups and downs that she’s experienced within our medical system, and how that took her to a different place in her own life and her own work. And the journey that got her to where she is today and the kind of work that she’s doing in supporting women and cycling beings in the world now, so I’m super excited to talk with Tiffany Narron, who is a writer, poet, postpartum and bereavement doula living in the mountains of North Carolina on Cherokee ancestral land. She holds a bachelor’s degree in communications from the University of North Carolina in Asheville, as well as a Master’s certificate in narrative medicine and brings countless hours of training and lived experience to her work in writing, compassionate communication and bereavement support. She holds monthly women’s grief circles and works with clients individually, creating space to allow the more painful stories of the body forward. She blends poetry, breathwork Narrative Medicine, somatic centering and an integration techniques alongside creative healing arts modalities, to meet her community in their grief, creating a warm, nurturing safe space for witness and integration. You can find out more at tiffanynarron.com. Welcome.
Tiffany Narron 1:35
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Christine Garvin 1:36
Absolutely. So, you know, as I was just saying, I think that you have what I want to kind of call a unique experience. And yet probably a lot of people out there have a somewhat similar experience in navigating, you know, our healthcare system and trying to figure out what’s going on with our bodies from a reproductive stance. So let’s just start off with your story and your history and kind of what got you here today?
Tiffany Narron 2:08
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so it’s impossible to we were just saying it’s impossible to separate that out of my own story, because my own story versus as is true for so many people was kind of the breaking open this, like, crossing a threshold, this, you know, realizing the ways that I wasn’t met and wasn’t seen and wasn’t cared for was the ways that I really needed to, like problem solve and understand how do we kind of bridge those divides? And, and how can I do that for myself? And then how can I do that in my community for others? And so I guess it you know, I can kind of go back so so far because my journey as a woman and my own like kind of hormonal path began when I was really young and and when I first got my cycle, when I was 15 years old, and they were really heavy and really intense and and my mom was so confused of just like, what do we do, you know, eating you Tylenol and letting you stay cool. And, and then fast forward through the years of of doing that and, and then navigating what this looks like as I grow older, and then being diagnosed and then not diagnosed with endometriosis. And trying to wrap my head around what that means. With that being a very confusing journey, with some doctors naming it and recognizing it as very real and other doctors saying, No, that’s not that’s not at all, you know, a real thing at all.
Christine Garvin 3:54
Wow, can I ask you really quick before you go on? The doctors that did diagnose you with Endo? You know, was that based symptomatically? Or was it based surgically? Or how did that go?
Tiffany Narron 4:07
Yeah, so I had a gynecologist early in my life diagnosed me with it based on symptoms and based on pelvic exams, very real evidence that like I had an issue. You know, I can see it. Gotcha. And so she was kind of an early advocate for me that made me feel like okay, this this can make sense now there’s at least a reason that this is happening to me versus people that are just like, Oh, I got my period and going on about today and you’re like,
Christine Garvin 4:37
How dare you
Tiffany Narron 4:41
so and then and then I guess in the same right, other doctors looking at those same set of symptoms and saying, Oh, well, this is totally normal and it’s some Tylenol and get back out. You know, just what
Christine Garvin 4:53
it is to be a woman.
Tiffany Narron 4:56
But it is yeah, yeah. So you know, at one at some Mmm, one point it’s clarifying and, and very validating. And then in the other half of that very confusing because it wasn’t shared agreement by doctors I was in my young adulthood. Yeah. And,
Christine Garvin 5:16
you know, I think I think the average is eight years before a woman will get diagnosed with endometriosis, you know, and I would say really just in the past couple of years, maybe five years, has the spotlight been on it enough for it to be a more common thing to talk to your OBGYN about for them to look for? And that kind of thing. So you’ve had years and years and years of women dealing with it having no idea that they have it?
Tiffany Narron 5:43
Absolutely, yeah, yeah, my my grandmother, because we have a long line of women in my family that they similar hormonal issues. Every single woman in my family has had a hysterectomy. Wow. One my cousins, my aunts. My grandmother, everyone. So, you know, there’s been this kind of like, Oh, me too. And, and also, you know, when I talk to the elder women in my family, they’re like, well, this talk wasn’t a talk that we were having.
Christine Garvin 6:15
Right? When discussions. Yeah, you just was that
Tiffany Narron 6:19
like, oh, well, you’re a woman, you know, this is
Christine Garvin 6:21
part of it. Yeah. man
Tiffany Narron 6:25
dressed, you know, form of it. So people that were in a time where there is a lot more awareness and advocacy, and there are a lot more women and ministering people coming to the table to say, you know, I need answers. We need support. And a lot of funding around it, too. So
Christine Garvin 6:45
finally, that’s starting to happen. Yeah. So did you get to a point then where you were okay, I’m officially do have endometriosis or officially don’t have endometriosis? What was the?
Tiffany Narron 6:59
Yeah, I kind of accepted that at a certain point and was like, okay, you know, this feels right for me, because all the signs and symptoms are there. And also, you know, what do I do with it was still the bigger question. Well, that’s great. And that’s helpful. But even looking at all the endometriosis related information is like, what there’s no cure? There’s surgery seems to be kind of the only like,
Christine Garvin 7:27
yeah, yeah, yeah. So many things with reproductive health, that kind of just comes down to just do surgery to take it out.
Tiffany Narron 7:36
Yeah, yeah, totally. Which I’ve always been just really reluctant to do as someone that thought I want to have children at some point in my life, I’d like to explore that. And I want to see a more holistic way of like, How can I sustainably move through this in my life? Learn how to be with this set of circumstances that I have. And, and so, you know, I found 10s devices and herbal treatments and started, you know, walking the path of how do I sustainably meet myself with this set of symptoms, you know?
Christine Garvin 8:12
Yeah. So then, at what point did things start to really shift and change for you either sort of in the positive or negative way?
Tiffany Narron 8:22
Yeah, yeah. It’s, it’s been like this kind of like circular, like a seasonal thing. Or like the second I really feel like I’ve got it dialed in that thing happens. And I can’t always pinpoint it and that there’s like a disruption, you know, something is triggering that then all the symptoms are set off again, and period worse. And all these things, the bloating first, appearances are growing larger than they should back out ecologist can detect them and I’m back in that same like, you know, oh, shit, whatever, you know why? And I thought I had this dialed in. In 2019, there was a really clear, strong ovarian to variances had overgrown on my ovaries. And we’re to the point where it was like, you know, we’re gonna have to do surgery word Mommy got hysterectomy again. And no, no, no, no, no.
Christine Garvin 9:20
Tiffany Narron 9:20
how is this possible? And what else can I do? I’ve been navigating this and and later in that I’m two months pregnant. Pregnant at the time, and how do I navigate this with this new information? Right. And the answers were still the same, you know, the solutions were still the same of well, we can do the surgery, or you can continue to you know, see how you see how you do with this. We don’t recommend
Christine Garvin 9:51
so you had this cysts while you were pregnant. Yeah, that was going on. Okay. So much. I feel Yeah, it was before and then I got pregnant and I’m sure because of the higher estrogen and everything that Yeah.
Tiffany Narron 10:05
And there was a lot of stress in that time. And it’s kind of hard to separate out. It’s like, you know, you’re, you’re stressed you’re this is happening before, which is stressful, and you’re having to re doctor so much more, which causes more structure. Absolutely. Yeah. How do I get back into, like, maintain this balance in my body? And, and that is not an easy thing.
Christine Garvin 10:27
Right. Right. Yeah. So then what happened next?
Tiffany Narron 10:31
Yeah, so then I was in and out of the hospital having these looked at having the CES looked at, I was in and out of the hospital just for appointments with my gyno and kind of checking on the pregnancy and, and then they said, Okay, we’re going to do a lap, laparoscopic surgery, they won’t harm your pregnancy. This will all be okay. And, and so, you know, I felt confident and that said, Okay, let’s just go this route. And when I went in for the laparoscopic surgery, I was just a wreck, you know, of having to go through that process and not knowing even though there was reassurance you’ll be okay. And, and it ended up being okay, the laparoscopic surgery, everything went fine. And and I miscarried. And for the surgery after the surgery, yeah. And you know, there’s so many different reasons why and how it was in kind of in that early termination time at two months, when you know, and I learned all of that later, but it was devastating and help kind of the processing of what just happened and why. And what do I do moving forward? You know, is this? Is this something that’s going to happen again, how can I break this cycle? I still had a lot of questions, maybe more questions.
Christine Garvin 11:57
Yeah. And I just want to pause for a moment for anybody listening that has had a miscarriage, and what you know, and obviously, heartbreaking experience, that is when you want to have, you know, a child, and then on top of the fact of you are already experiencing trauma, having to go to the doctor that much, you know, and I definitely can understand that and the PTSD that forms, right, because you’re like, it’s not like you come out of there better most of the time. Right? Yeah, it’s just kind of leads to more questions and, and that that’s something that, you know, we all need, if we go through an experience like that, it’s like really being cognizant of the impact that it can have on us. Right. And, and I know, we don’t all have access to therapy and everything, but you know, to do what you can in order to get support and that process because it really can impact you for the long term. Right, if you’re not able to, to work with it, and through it and process it.
Tiffany Narron 12:57
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think that was, that was part of that confusion of just kind of being sped out of the medical system and like, sent home and it’s like, you know, yeah, and you’re like, Well, my body’s still hurting, and I’m grieving and, and I still don’t fully understand how I move forward with this, you know, so just all all of the questions and what I later really identified as it’s a lot of grief that I was holding, and like, didn’t know how to process and who to process that with, like, it’s not my medical team, clearly. people that knew enough about those processes and knew enough about you know, loss and all these different things to hold space with me, that then became this like journey of like, where do I find these people? And, you know, how am I connecting the dots for myself, I’m a poor myself.
Christine Garvin 13:57
Right? Right. And I just want to also acknowledge how hard it can be to be an advocate for yourself, when you’re in the middle of that process to you know, and it’s like, that’s, you know, my I think my dream for this country, among many different things we could shift and change is for everybody to have an advocate that that goes into hospital right because particularly in our healthcare system now that it’s just packing the amount of patients per doctor and nurse and everything you know, and it’s not I don’t even blame the doctors and nurses because it’s a system that is putting way too much on them too. Right? And and then so we have so many people that are languishing because they don’t have somebody to advocate for them. You know, I went through that myself in the hospital and also with others that have gone to the hospital where I’ve ended up being the advocate, you know, so you know, I know for your for you, obviously, advocating for yourself is kind of what got you to doing the work that you’re doing now, but you know, I’m sure that was really intense and tough for you to have to get through at that time.
Tiffany Narron 15:06
Yeah, yeah, it was, it was. It was messy. It was just like a really messy, empowering mix of of things that’s like, Oh, I found someone and then I found this resource then I, you know, had to like really search, a lot of searching in the middle of feeling really like disempowered and being in my body still, and trying really hard just to go through the motions of working and you know, being back at work and
Christine Garvin 15:35
like taking care of life.
Tiffany Narron 15:37
Yeah, yeah, totally. And like, it’s not it wasn’t necessarily something where it was like, Oh, you’re given some time off work, you know, like a real passing. And so there was like this kind of unnamed grief. So it felt like I was in some weird liminal space. And you Yeah, and I had to really fight to find the things that I found. For me, that was like, oh, what endometriosis says, and you believe in advocating for, for folks with it and have real resources for folks with atria cysts, or you people here like know what it’s like to to lose a child and early loss. And there’s, you know, here’s this group that can really nurture me and witness me. Process though, it was like, yes, yes, yes. Just need to like do these things every day. And you know why? And
Christine Garvin 16:32
yeah. What were some of the things that you found that were helpful, I guess, at that point, post miscarriage with the endometriosis that were, you know, really supportive for you?
Tiffany Narron 16:46
Yeah, yeah, I found the endometriosis Foundation of America, I think it’s endometriosis Foundation of America. And they have tons of resources on their website. And I was able to find groups, different support groups and connect with other women, where we would like on calls together and, you know, telling our stories and it was just so nurturing and supportive, I didn’t think I would be able to find something like that. So specifically for me that I really needed that and everyone had experiences of different kinds of struggles and loss and pain. And this is ongoing kind of confusion web trio. So you know, otherwise, kind of navigate life with this and and I started taking some there was a combination of like workshops of like, around loss, early loss and miscarriage and holding space, holding space for yourself and then learning to hold space for others because I was I think it took me a while to step into that holding space. For others. There was a good year where it was just how to hold space for myself.
Christine Garvin 18:00
Yeah, you’re like, I don’t have that capacity. Thanks. Anyway.
Tiffany Narron 18:04
Just smile on your shoulder. Yeah. Can you hold space for me? Because my nervous systems are racking. And so that Yeah, those were my two main kind of focus areas for myself was around miscarriage and, and grief and around endometriosis and kind of hormonal support with other folks that knew that.
Christine Garvin 18:28
Were there you know, dietary changes, any particular supplements or anything like that, that you found was really useful for you?
Tiffany Narron 18:36
Yeah, yeah, I kind of after the six months, I’ve was led into working with an endocrinologist and the endocrinologist had all kinds of like, very, like, factual information for me based on my blood work. And we were able to say, well, actually, you know, your body is having flare ups when it comes to dairy and alcohol and gluten and, you know, and now I know that a lot of those are pretty common triggers for folks with endometriosis. But you have to just unravel the layers. Absolutely.
Christine Garvin 19:12
And you kind of have to hear sometimes that it’s helpful with testing right to see all the tests like okay, like legit Yeah,
Tiffany Narron 19:21
yeah. And I think that was really I think I needed that most of all, it wasn’t just like a random suggestion that I read on the internet it was like your as your blood work, here’s your body. And this is your body’s responding to some of these things. So like, one by one started weeding out the okay well, how is my body feeling now? And there was a huge shift in how I was feeling that pain each month and, and tracking my cycles. Huge shift over the next year of like how I felt in my body and how, no more variances, no more overgrown variances, we all have variances, but I was not reaching pain points of feeling that in my body? Oh, yeah, that was.
Christine Garvin 20:08
Yeah. And first of all, I want to say, it’s awesome that you found an endocrinologist like that, right? Because they’re not all that good. You know, like, there’s some great ones out there. But there’s a can be lacking sometimes. And there sort of expanded knowledge. But, you know, just for people listening, you know, I mean, I obviously talked about fibroids a lot. But in a lot of senses of variants, cysts are kind of stemming from the same kind of place. And, you know, so much of why I mean, dairy, we know, is inflammatory. To many people systems, you know, just, it’s just a sort of common thing with the casein and there, but particularly around hormones that can kick stuff up. But you know, I always I often go back to, how is your body detoxifying? Or metabolizing? Estrogen, right, because if it’s not able to do that, well, that is when we have what I call growths, like fibroids, and cysts and polyps and things like that, and our, you know, reproductive system. And so, you know, something like cutting out alcohol, because the liver has to detoxify alcohol, first and foremost, you know, your hormones get pushed to the back of the line, and particularly estrogen, we really want to make sure it’s being metabolized or detoxified. Well, so you cut out that alcohol, then that helps estrogen move up, you know, gluten has such an inflammatory reaction for so many people to and that inflammation, you know, impacts the processing. So there’s, it’s all of this, like, you know, people were like, oh, that’s just a fad to, like, cut these things out. But it’s like, it’s a very direct, you know, correlation to how our hormones are working in our body.
Tiffany Narron 21:47
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It’s just, it just keeps going. And, you know, and I do know, that, yeah, I’ve had doctor sent some, you know, you could have a drink here and there, it’s not totally throw you over. easier for me to just cut it out and score it. And, you know, I’m like, I’m, I’m good. Yeah, I’m okay. Without that.
Christine Garvin 22:11
And honestly, there’s, I mean, there’s so many studies coming out right now about how even any amount of alcohol really isn’t good for us. You know, it’s not good for our brain health. It’s not good for a lots of different things. And so, I mean, I’m certainly I drink occasionally, and I’m not telling people to not drink at all, but I can see, you know, for a lot of people, it is just easier to kind of cut it out across the board. Because it’s it’s an easy, slippery slope. Right? Yeah. Like you have one and then you’re like, Yeah, you’re like that was okay. Last night. So on tonight, you know, and there you go. Yeah. So, okay, so you made those changes, and then you started to, you know, really calm down. So at this point, you know, you you basically the only surgery that you had done was that the laparoscopic surgery, right? Yep. Yeah. So you haven’t had to have hysterectomies?
Tiffany Narron 23:02
I have not, but it has been suggested again, and it continues to be now that I’m 38. It wasn’t as much. You know, when I was younger, they really don’t find that but once you go over 30 They’re like, love you.
Christine Garvin 23:19
No, yeah. You shouldn’t be having kids anyway, as a little take it out. See only purpose for being there. Yeah, yeah. So So do you still have some issues coming up with it monthly at this point?
Tiffany Narron 23:34
Yeah. It’s not a like a perfect like, oh, no, like, yeah.
Christine Garvin 23:40
It’s an auto immune disorder. So it’s like it’s there. Yeah,
Tiffany Narron 23:44
yeah. And, you know, I’ve done so much like kind of genealogy and family. Unpacking aspects of like, hypothyroidism runs in the women in my family as well. So we have chronic kind of underactive thyroids, surprise, surprise. Yeah. So, like, how do I meet that aspect of what my, my, that hormonal regulation in my body is a whole other, but I had to kind of like learn to sort out and then the nervous system regulation, I notice, especially like, looking to my mom, or, you know, your families, your greatest teachers, then, you know, this tendency to be more like act in an activated state. And, and, and maybe that’s, you know, I’ve thought of it in so many different ways, but Irish lineage and working class, you know, sure, that we’re kind of hardwired to be like, let’s go, let’s, let’s go, go go and, and that, that kind of constant triggered state also lends itself to this, you know, system, hormonal system that’s like triggering all these responses in my body. So right,
Christine Garvin 24:55
right. And, you know, I also talked about this a lot for people but the You know, if people don’t know, you know, our endocrine or endocrine system, really, if you think about it, the big aspects of it our ovaries, you know, in those of us that can reproduce, and then our thyroid and our adrenals, right, and it’s all controlled, essentially, in the brain, the brain is the one giving all the signals, and your body is always going to focus on keeping you alive first and foremost. And so that is where if we’re in that stress response, that fight flight or freeze response, you know, that sort of nervous system up up here, you know, there’s a focus your brains, like, alright, we’re keeping you alive, we’re pumping out that cortisol, and we’re going to go, we call down regulate your sex hormone production in your ovaries, right. So this is why I always talk about first and foremost, when you’re working with hormonal issues, you got to work essentially, with your adrenals, you’ve got to work with your nervous system, because you can’t skirt around it and make your estrogen and progesterone work like perfectly. You know, it’s like, it comes back to that again, and again. And I think the point that you made, like the genealogy is such a huge important part, you know, the specific genetics, you know, and how we actually process stress in our DNA, you know, is hugely important. And we live in a culture that is constant, go, go go and really elevates that right? In so many ways. And so it’s, it’s tough to kind of go against the grain and do much relaxing or taking time off, or any of those kinds of things. So it’s like you have all of those places to consider along with trauma. We do know, you know, that trauma lives in our tissues, essentially, and can cause that, too. So these are all places worth looking at.
Tiffany Narron 26:50
Huh? Yeah, no problem. Good luck.
Christine Garvin 26:53
Yeah. Got that taken care of? And like a week? Yeah, yeah. So in other words, it’s a constant process. Yeah. So tell us more about, you know, the work that you have, that you’re doing now. I mean, there’s such a, as you know, we kind of talked about and then before we got on, it’s like you really crafted your own way, rather than kind of going the traditional routes, in terms of maybe, you know, health care training. So you want to talk a little bit about that?
Tiffany Narron 27:29
Sure. Yeah. I mean, kind of just became me after a while, the way this does, you know, where you’re like, well, now I’m on a healing journey. As I continue to explore all of these things, I need more space in my life, for healing and regulating and, and I naturally want other people to have that too, you know. And so in weaving all these threads, I did a lot of a lot of trainings and kind of poured myself into my work for for, you know, the last for the first year and a half and still doing training is probably always, always learning. But kind of crafting of approaching, well, how do we hold these things together? How do we hold space for loss and trauma and grief? How do we process and integrate? Really, how do we make space for it? With my approach to navigate that, so it feels a little bit less? Just like we’re in an emotional sea, you know? And so, yeah, so I, I did a lot of studying in somatic polyvagal theory, body based, how do we come back into our body? How do we? How do we access our own felt sense of embodiment? And pairing that with my background in communications, of course, then studying Narrative Medicine of how do we tell our stories? How do we come vulnerably you know, with our stories to a space, where we feel safe and held and can could co regulate our nervous system, another regulated nervous system, and a safe space. And so kind of partnering those things to find a way through and and how, how I hold space for one person at four groups and, and I really love I love both of those for different reasons. I love one on one space, because you really get that CO regulation. And you can really, like dive deep with one person and their nervous system and their trauma. And in groupspaces There’s a really beautiful, like shared felt sense that everyone touch and hold and realize, like, Oh, we’re all having like vastly different and similar experiences, you know?
Christine Garvin 29:59
Yeah. Wow, wow. And then how did where does the doula part come in?
Tiffany Narron 30:04
Yeah, yeah. The doula work started as grief doula work naturally, and wanting to hold space for other birthing people that have had early loss and experienced child loss. And so realizing that there wasn’t a in person space in my community where folks could feel represented and held being like, where is there a place I can go? And, and that was what I was looking for, for long. Where do I go with this? You know, there’s crisis centers everywhere. And but there’s no place that I can see mental health therapists perhaps, right. But I couldn’t really find that, that in between of like, well, I have a therapist in there wonderful. But you know, where is a place that I could go and, and have someone that really knows this experience and me and feels, you know, within the vein of of, you know, as me as a naturopath and someone that holds my life and my values in a certain way, someone that could really call it all of those things. So grief doula work was how it how the doula work all started.
Christine Garvin 31:19
Yeah. And I think it’s so important. And the reason I brought up doula specifically is because I think a lot of people think, Oh, just doula is you’re there in the hospital to help you know, a person give birth or support them in their birthing process. But there’s all kinds of doula Aang, right, like, you know, the postpartum dueling and all of that, and, and it makes me think about, you know, how it was done for most of all of time. In terms of, you know, traditional cultures in general, I don’t want to say overall, you know, traditional cultures, but probably even, you know, in European cultures, it was like women were, I mean, until we had, quote, unquote, Western medicine developed in, you know, the mid 19th century. It was really women that were doing the birthing and supporting each other in that birthing process, you know, and so, we really have lost that sort of community connection, right? And support, which I think is partly why it’s so hard to just, even if you have a healthy baby, yeah, it’s so hard. And
Tiffany Narron 32:29
yeah, that’s what led into postpartum was like, well, everyone’s holding this like grief, in a different way. Maybe you did have a child, but now you there’s this, like, loss of a sense of self? And when, and what is my new life? Now? You know, a lot of the tools are,
Christine Garvin 32:46
you’re depleted as hell, because you just gave birth?
Tiffany Narron 32:50
Yeah, absolutely. So like, a lot of the tools I have found are the same, you know, some are very specific. And yet, a lot of them are very similar. Like, how do we come back into ourselves? How do we hold ourselves? How are we held by to help or even find that, oh, this is what I need. Or this is my, this is my felt sense of, of my needs, or you just are just giving you time to rest and be with? Which is like such an honor to hold that space? And to help someone find that for themselves?
Christine Garvin 33:26
Is it ever hard for you having gone through, you know, the experience that you went through?
Tiffany Narron 33:32
Yeah, people ask me that a lot. And, I mean, hell yeah. Yeah, it is, you know, I have to have my own space, I hold a lot of healing space for myself, to not take on other folks stories and really processed out after I’ve held space with someone and kind of clear my own energy and come back into my stuff. Oh, so like, you know, it’s interesting doing this work is like, it requires so much more space held for yourself to Yeah, yeah. To navigate holding that for other people.
Christine Garvin 34:06
Right. Right. And I think that’s really important for you know, any, maybe newer practitioner that’s listening, because any kind of practice where you’re really trying to be there for someone else and hold space for others, like it can be even if it’s not triggering, per se, it can be super draining. And so, it becomes more important to set up these these systems for yourself, you know, whatever kind of support that you need from elsewhere and, and what you need to do to kind of Yeah, let let go of the stuff that you sort of, maybe take on in the process.
Tiffany Narron 34:44
Yeah, absolutely. And making sure that you aren’t somehow like imprinting that on someone else and an experience that I can show up because that won’t show up if I feel like I emotionally can’t or you know, my nervous Some can’t take it, then, you know, I’ll let someone else know, hey, I need to reschedule or let’s do this another day. Equally as important is that you have someone that can show up for you and not isn’t, isn’t shared, right? Or because then you’re with Brett, that’s what happens when you’re with a friend is just, you know, we
Christine Garvin 35:18
relate we want to. Right, right, right, absolutely.
Tiffany Narron 35:21
practitioner you’re showing up as, as someone with a regulated nervous system that that can just hold what you’re bringing to the table and help navigate. How do we how do we move through this? How does this feel, you know, that holding space, holding space for someone to process and be with that grief? And that grief?
Christine Garvin 35:44
Yeah, and I’m glad that you brought up sort of your modeling and letting people know that, you know, that you can say today is not working for me, can we reschedule? You know, I think this is such an important thing. That’s coming up in discussions more recently, right? We were searching this like hustle mode for so long. And I know, within my own business, like, there are so many times where it’s like, I really right now, I’m not going to do my best right to, like, show up. But I but I did. And you know, and that’s fine sometimes. But really, I like that we’re moving into honoring that. And saying, I want to do the best for both this other person and myself. So you know, today is not it. Let’s reschedule and that that’s more than okay to do.
Tiffany Narron 36:33
Yeah, yeah. Hard, because it’s like flying in the face of capitalism. Like, well, this is our culture. And so how do I make space in a in a society? That thing? That’s not how you, you know, like,
Christine Garvin 36:45
that’s absolutely, yeah, it’s, it’s radical work? Really, you know, and it’s not easy. So, you know, props to talking about it and modeling it. So, at this point, are you are you able to get pregnant? If? Yeah, okay. So is that something that you’re,
Tiffany Narron 37:05
me and my husband are trying right now, actually, and seeing the demo? And, you know, we were just going to see where that leads us, we have kind of a time limit on how much time we’re gonna spend there. And, you know, for for our own nervous systems and well being. And we already know, kind of, like, how we want to navigate that, and what, what we feel like we want to do and don’t want to do and and then if it turns out that we can then, you know, then we’ll take a big trip to Hawaii, and you know, and move on with, with our periods. So, yeah, yeah. You know, interestingly, so many people told me, No, you can’t No, you can’t at all after these experiences that you
Christine Garvin 37:54
that you couldn’t get pregnant. The doctors telling you that. Yeah,
Tiffany Narron 37:57
yeah. You’re too old. Your variances, your endometriosis, all these things, you know, impossible. Like, don’t even think about it.
Christine Garvin 38:08
Did you come across a doctor that said, Oh, it is possible, fine. I
Tiffany Narron 38:12
found a great gynecologist that was like, you know, it is very possible. We can run all the tests and basically show you why it is very possible. And there’s a lot of different ways that can happen. So let’s see if that’s possible for you.
Christine Garvin 38:31
Yeah, I find it so interesting, because I think, you know, just the starting at that place of Oh, you’re over 35. Right. They’re already telling you even though that’s really not based, I mean, so individual, right, you know, it’s not based on any kind of real fact. But then yeah, they’re like, Oh, we’re just looking at this, what you’ve been through, and so it’s not going to happen, rather than, you know, really look at the specifics of what’s happening in your body. And again, that’s where testing can be really helpful, right? And really show instead of just discarding based on sort of your past history and everything. And yeah, I mean, and all the work that you do to take care of yourself, you know, I mean, it’s amazing what the body can do.
Tiffany Narron 39:16
Absolutely. Yes, it is. And you know, it’s interesting how much that kind of like over that very generic kind of chart read and then a dismissive, dismissive, you know, answer then and it’s like, what are you facing?
Christine Garvin 39:31
Yeah. Right. Yeah. Their own preconceived notions. Yeah, yeah.
Tiffany Narron 39:37
Yeah, absolutely. That it may be hard for them. Because learn to give that answer based on looking at these, like you said, you know, based on looking at Oh, you’re over 35 You’ve had endometriosis and had a miscarriage. Yeah.
Christine Garvin 39:53
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Wow. Well, thank you so much for sharing all this. Incredible information live. So today I know that, you know, there’s certainly some some people listening that can identify with with some of what you’ve talked about. And, you know, I first had, let’s say, how can people work with you if they’re interested in working with you?
Tiffany Narron 40:15
Yeah, yeah, you can reach out to me I have my my website that’s more around my writing work and communication work is Tiffany nair.com. But a light in the valley is all of my resourcing work around somatic practices. So I do one on one sessions with with women and birthing persons and grief work sessions. And I host some monthly workshops that I announce on my lighten the valley Instagram page. So
Christine Garvin 40:42
nice. And can people work with you? Wherever they are kind of thing? Or does it need
Tiffany Narron 40:47
a whole virtual sessions. I’m moving studios right now within Morrisville for quite a bit, but I’m changing studio spaces. So virtually is primarily my mood right now, I do have a lot of upcoming in person workshops. If you’re in western North Carolina. I’m holding some spaces and different wellness facilities and, and those are all listed on my website too. Nice.
Christine Garvin 41:09
Great. Well, thank you so much for doing this work. Because I think, you know, it’s certainly as we talked about earlier, when we go through these, our own experiences, you know, often it will lead us into doing that kind of work supporting others, but it doesn’t mean it’s easy, you know? And, you know, so it’s, I think a lot of people like they’re like, Oh, you came out of this horrible situation. And now you’re doing this amazing work in the world. I know, I hear that all the time. And I’m like, yeah, it’s not like pretty clean and all, you know, perfect. Like that sounds, you know, I will always deal with some of the repercussions of what I went through, you know, and how that impacts me. And that, you know, plays into work too. So it’s like, you got to keep on, as we’ve talked about, you got to keep on doing the healing work for yourself, you know, isn’t just like, Oh, we’re done with that hard stuff. Now, yeah. All right. So that’s the real deal, everybody. All right. Well, thank you again for being here with us today. And I will see you all next week.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai